New Products

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New Products

Postby shellshock » Tue Jan 07, 2014 12:02 pm

I want to suggest a 251 style mic, and of course, Peluso makes their "VTB" based on the Sony C800G, so maybe a dual tube microphone as well? Maybe even different headbasket choices? Tell you what, you start making preamps (especially 500 series) you have a for sure customer right here. Cheers!!

-Sammy
I like fat girls and fat sounding tube microphones. :)
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Re: New Products

Postby Dave Thomas » Wed Jan 08, 2014 11:48 am

Hi Sammy, thanks for your input and inquiries.

Yes, we will be introduce a 251 style microphone by early spring of this year. We are hoping to have the sample head grills by the end of next week so we can build up a prototype.

All, our tube microphones except for the CM28 hybrid fet/tube use a 2 stage tube circuit as the 6072a tube is a dual triode and it this is like having two tubes in one. The first 1/2 of the tube is configured as a head amp to optimize the capsule to tube "interface". Our head amp circuit has incredibly low distortion and there is no low frequency roll-off created by the self-bias circuitry when used in a single stage tube circuit. The 2nd stage is dc coupled and drives the output transformer from <600 ohm which is 10 times lower than the venerable original U47 circuit.

In the original C12 and ELA M251 only 1/2 of the 6072a tube is used and the 2nd half was saved for use in the C24 stereo microphone. In the C12 the output is take from the plate of the 6072a which has an impedance up at 20K ohms and a 17:1 ratio transformer must be used. Our CCDA circuit is a vast improvement increase the headroom and transparency significantly.

The output circuit of out tube microphones is more like the C800g which drives the output transformer from the cathode. We find the 2 stage circuit with its Cathode output circuit superior to the single stage cathode follower circuit used in the C37a and C800g microphones. I use to have to C37a tube microphones during my tenure at Ocean Sound Studios during the 80's.

We will never make a bottle microphone not because of sound quality but because Hitler used the Neumann bottle microphone to address Nazi Germany and the World at the 1936 Olympics. I am a great believer in KARMA and I would much rather put up a CM47 which is like the U47 used by John Lennon to record "Give Peace a Change" than the bottle microphone that was used to advocate for genocide of the Jewish race.

I have the drawings for a 500 series transformer coupled discrete class "A" preamp but I will not have the time to build up a prototype until our stand alone discrete class "A" preamp and our class "A" tube preamps are into final production runs this coming spring.

Cheers, Dave

shellshock wrote:I want to suggest a 251 style mic, and of course, Peluso makes their "VTB" based on the Sony C800G, so maybe a dual tube microphone as well? Maybe even different headbasket choices? Tell you what, you start making preamps (especially 500 series) you have a for sure customer right here. Cheers!!

-Sammy
Dave Thomas
 
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Re: New Products

Postby shellshock » Wed Jan 08, 2014 2:55 pm

Can't really argue with that logic!
My research does tell me that the Sony C800G uses a revoiced U67-type capsule. I do love the CM12, so would using that body, possibly a different transformer and a 67 (or slightly variated capsule) bring us the sound of the Sony C800G without bringing us bad Karma?

I'm glad you picked up on karma and vibe...the energy and mood of the room can effect a recording far more than the sonic signature of ANY microphone, preamp, or AD converter!
I like fat girls and fat sounding tube microphones. :)
shellshock
 
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Re: New Products

Postby Dave Thomas » Tue Jan 14, 2014 6:01 pm

Hello, you are correct Sony moved to a modified K67 type capsule in the C800g.

The curve looks strikingly similar to our CM47 which also uses a modified K67 type capsule.

The advantage of the CM47 is that it has 9 patterns and a 2-stage circuit with more headroom and a faster transient response plus it sell for about $10,000 less than a New C800g did.


Cheers, Dave




shellshock wrote:Can't really argue with that logic!
My research does tell me that the Sony C800G uses a revoiced U67-type capsule. I do love the CM12, so would using that body, possibly a different transformer and a 67 (or slightly variated capsule) bring us the sound of the Sony C800G without bringing us bad Karma?

I'm glad you picked up on karma and vibe...the energy and mood of the room can effect a recording far more than the sonic signature of ANY microphone, preamp, or AD converter!
Attachments
CM47 Cardiod.jpg
AA CM47 Cardiod
CM47 Cardiod.jpg (146.92 KiB) Viewed 21577 times
C-800G Frequency Response2.jpg
Sony 800g Cardiod
C-800G Frequency Response2.jpg (475.1 KiB) Viewed 21577 times
Dave Thomas
 
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Re: New Products

Postby mabell313 » Sun Jan 19, 2014 5:17 am

Dave Thomas wrote:Hi Sammy, thanks for your input and inquiries.

Yes, we will be introduce a 251 style microphone by early spring of this year. We are hoping to have the sample head grills by the end of next week so we can build up a prototype.

All, our tube microphones except for the CM28 hybrid fet/tube use a 2 stage tube circuit as the 6072a tube is a dual triode and it this is like having two tubes in one. The first 1/2 of the tube is configured as a head amp to optimize the capsule to tube "interface". Our head amp circuit has incredibly low distortion and there is no low frequency roll-off created by the self-bias circuitry when used in a single stage tube circuit. The 2nd stage is dc coupled and drives the output transformer from <600 ohm which is 10 times lower than the venerable original U47 circuit.

In the original C12 and ELA M251 only 1/2 of the 6072a tube is used and the 2nd half was saved for use in the C24 stereo microphone. In the C12 the output is take from the plate of the 6072a which has an impedance up at 20K ohms and a 17:1 ratio transformer must be used. Our CCDA circuit is a vast improvement increase the headroom and transparency significantly.

The output circuit of out tube microphones is more like the C800g which drives the output transformer from the cathode. We find the 2 stage circuit with its Cathode output circuit superior to the single stage cathode follower circuit used in the C37a and C800g microphones. I use to have to C37a tube microphones during my tenure at Ocean Sound Studios during the 80's.

We will never make a bottle microphone not because of sound quality but because Hitler used the Neumann bottle microphone to address Nazi Germany and the World at the 1936 Olympics. I am a great believer in KARMA and I would much rather put up a CM47 which is like the U47 used by John Lennon to record "Give Peace a Change" than the bottle microphone that was used to advocate for genocide of the Jewish race.

I have the drawings for a 500 series transformer coupled discrete class "A" preamp but I will not have the time to build up a prototype until our stand alone discrete class "A" preamp and our class "A" tube preamps are into final production runs this coming spring.

Cheers, Dave

shellshock wrote:I want to suggest a 251 style mic, and of course, Peluso makes their "VTB" based on the Sony C800G, so maybe a dual tube microphone as well? Maybe even different headbasket choices? Tell you what, you start making preamps (especially 500 series) you have a for sure customer right here. Cheers!!

-Sammy



Pretty damn arrogant if you ask me about the microphone. The mic did not kill anyone nor did it advocate the killings either. Please do not use this new forum as your soapbox. Neumann designers did not design said mic to"address Nazi Germany". It is just a mic. I can see how some things can evoke some painful memories but I doubt that the mic had ANYTHING to do with it. I am sorry you feel this way. I am not trying to defend Hitler or Nazi Germany, they got what was coming. In this new century we all need to look forward to a brighter future as apposed to focussing on all things negative from the past.
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Re: New Products but No bottle microphone from us

Postby Dave Thomas » Sun Jan 19, 2014 12:31 pm

I know all that!!! I have nothing against the electronics or design or the brilliance George Neumann it is just unfortunately who ended up using it from 1936 to 1945. Again this is my "personal opinion".

I don't like IBM either because they sold all the punch cards to Nazi Germany that were used to keep track of the Jews sent to concentration camps.

When I put up a 47 type microphone I think of John Lennon singing "Give Peace a Chance" or " Imagine" when I see a bottle microphone I am reminded of this image of Hitler.

It maybe arrogant on my part but I just don't want this image "in my recording space" it is not very Zen like!!!! There is a great interview with John Peluso on NPR Radio where he believes, "that part of the popularity of the Hitler was due to the bottle microphone" John forwards the idea that the ability of these first LDC bottle microphone to capture more of the anger, character and dynamics of Hitler's voice compared to other microphones of the day and the subseqent invention of sound systems is what made Hitler sound so "charismatic". He basically sounded better than anyone else on the radio back in the late 30's and early 40's. Neumann made a great contribution to the improvement of sound quality in the 30's and unfortunately Hitler took advantage of it to forward his ultra extreme facist rule. Now, there was an arrogant lot...Hitler, Goering, Goebells, Eichmann, Heydrich and Himmler are the dictionary definition of arrogance in my book.

Peace, Dave
Attachments
JohnLennon47.jpg
JohnLennon47.jpg (240.91 KiB) Viewed 21557 times
Hitler's Microphone.jpg
Hitler's Microphone.jpg (43.71 KiB) Viewed 21557 times
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Re: New Products

Postby mabell313 » Mon Jan 20, 2014 7:39 am

This is starting to sound a little anti-Germanic and pretty damn offensive. Every @##&%+e warlord/dictator uses the latest technologies to their advantage. Most recently look at Syria with Assad. Need I say more. So you do not like the shape, that is fine. Let us not ruin this brand new forum with socio/political rants and soapboxing! I would love for this forum to be great like some of the other forums out there(groupdiy comes to mind). But, with this kind of soapboxing going on over here, I am pretty sure that is enough to turn more than a few people away. Myself for one. So, save the political rants for one of those types of forums and let this one grow into a wonderful forum people can come and learn about your awesome products. Thank you again Dave. You have great products and a wonderful website. Again, the political rants WILL NOT be tolerated! Much love to all and let us ALL move toward making this century one of great discovery and learning not another 100 years of war. "All we are sayin' is give peace a chance"
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Re: New Products

Postby Dave Thomas » Mon Jan 20, 2014 11:09 am

Hello, I completely agree. I am not soapboxing but simply stating why I prefer the U47 imagery over the bottle microphone imagery. I am not anti-Germanic I just don't like the bottle microphone imagery.

Someone wrote, "Those who don't study history are doomed to repeat it. Yet those who do study history are doomed to stand by helplessly while everyone else repeats it."

We do not repeat the circuits from the 50's and 60's in our microphones but prefer to improve the tube circuit with the latest tube technology.

Unfortunately or fortunately, what comes along with my neary 50's years on the planet as a Pro Audio tech is my overview of the World from when I was a child in the 50's until today. I have been on Planet Earth for 66 years.

What you get with my audio expertise is also my degree in Criminology, my 10 years of experience as a foster home for teens at risk and my experiences working with many rock band in the 60's and all my lifes experiences.

I am all for making the 21st Century one of great discovery and learning. "Imagine there's no countries it isn't hard to do...Nothing to kill or die for and no religion too. Imagine all the poeple living life in peace."

Roughly, 50 million people died during the 2nd World War years and over 50 million people have died in wars around the world since then. Hopefully, the 21st century will a more peaceful outcome than the 20th century did and our microphones will be around to record a more enlightened society.





mabell313 wrote:This is starting to sound a little anti-Germanic and pretty damn offensive. Every @##&%+e warlord/dictator uses the latest technologies to their advantage. Most recently look at Syria with Assad. Need I say more. So you do not like the shape, that is fine. Let us not ruin this brand new forum with socio/political rants and soapboxing! I would love for this forum to be great like some of the other forums out there(groupdiy comes to mind). But, with this kind of soapboxing going on over here, I am pretty sure that is enough to turn more than a few people away. Myself for one. So, save the political rants for one of those types of forums and let this one grow into a wonderful forum people can come and learn about your awesome products. Thank you again Dave. You have great products and a wonderful website. Again, the political rants WILL NOT be tolerated! Much love to all and let us ALL move toward making this century one of great discovery and learning not another 100 years of war. "All we are sayin' is give peace a chance"
Dave Thomas
 
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Re: New Products

Postby mabell313 » Mon Jan 20, 2014 5:14 pm

Thanks Dave. Love you man and keep up the great work.
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Re: New Products

Postby shellshock » Wed Jul 24, 2019 3:34 pm

Weird...5 years ago I was a Music Production student wanting an affordable microphone comparable to the 251 and the C800G. Today, I own both of these from AA. Kind of weird looking back on it, eh?
I like fat girls and fat sounding tube microphones. :)
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